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If you look at evil and good alignments, you'll realise something.
Evil gets the shaft.
Good align gets good resistances, less common vulns, 2h weapon in 1h, better remort abilities (which are lacking everywhere imho).
What does evil get?
3 out of 4 evil races are vuln to fire (the most common of elemental type damage), no evil race has a good resistance (minotaurs are immune to cold, so that means that chill touch which is worthless and a cold dracon/dragon breath doesn't hurt us. wow).
If you look at the elf/drow, vampire/slayer, sith/draconina, titan/minotaur thing, this is what you get.
elf is resistant to magic, drow is resistant to charm. elf gets a bonus when shooting with ranged weapons, drow does not. elf gets bow, drow gets xbow. In the end, elf wins out.
Slayer gets a 25% dmg bonus to evil, vampire gets nothing. vampire is vuln to holy, fire, and light. so divine touch, holy fire, flaming bite, etc all hurt it. slayer is vuln to negative, so basically only the soulcutter hurts them. Both do get shift. Slayer wins out.
Draconian gets breathe, Sith get toxins. Toxins are a very good skill, as is breathe (if you know how to use it to your advantage, not many dracons/dragons seem to). Dracons are vuln to cold. Sith are vuln to fire and pierce. Sith are resistant to nothing but immune to poison, while draconians are resistant to bash, fire, and charm (the charm is about meaningless). These two are about even, but giving sith a resistance to cold would balance it a little more.
Titan gets titanic attack, allowing the titan to do an extra attack every round. Minotaur gets charge which does minimal damage to everything in the room and eats up movement. Titans are vuln to lightning, Minotaurs are vuln to fire (surprisingly, the vulns on these two balance out very well I feel). Titan automatically get bash, fast healing, and their titanic attack. Minotaurs automatically get bash and their charge. titans are resist to cold and fire, minotaurs are immune to cold (cold is very uncommon in this game). Titans also get the extraordinary ability to use a two handed weapon in one hand, allowing them to do up to 300 damage a round extra.
Minotaurs get nothing of the sort. Winner: Titan.
So, looking at that, you have elf, titan, slayer, and a tie with sith and draconian. Sure looks to me like evil gets the shaft.
Look at neutral even.
Dwarves are resistant to all forms of elemental damage, they get berserk (which in it's own is very useful), and they have the ability to go any classes they wish.)
Humans are meant to come with nothing and get nothing but be the most balanced out of them all.
Lich gets a bunch of cool unarmed abilities which are very useful if teamed up with monk (in the end they'll end up using weapons anyway though). Their resistances are amazing, yet their vulns will also hurt. being immune to lightning and kill are very useful also. Lich is probably the best rounded race for neutral, but being the newest race not many know of it's capabilities.
What I suggest:
We (as in everyone, immortal and mortal alike) discuss the possibilities of changes within the racial structure of this game. Things that will help balance the races out better (starting with mort, then remort). Things here in this game need fixed long before new things come out I feel. While the next upgrade has a lot to help the immortals in their building, there needs to be something to help mortals out a lot in balancing. One person shouldn't win every pk fight, one race shouldn't dominate another.
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HP Mana Move Total
Vamp 3350 3250 3250 9850
sith 3100 3000 3750 9850
Dwarf 3350 2750 3500 9600
Elf 2500 3750 2800 9050
Human 3000 3000 3000 9000
Drag 3150 2750 3000 8900
tita 3750 2450 2700 8900
drow 2750 3500 2600 8850
Slay 3250 2750 2750 8750
lich 2350 3850 2500 8700
mino 3500 2350 2500 8350
Sorry this is ugly, but oh well! :) Here we see the races aligned according to their natural stats.
Ok first off I agree with almost all of what myth said. I am going to have defend my race compared to vampire. Do you guys see the vamps stats? Lets not stop there, I'm not agreeing with fire being the most common element in the game. Every race does have access to fireball, and there are a few fire damage weapons. Now, look at almost every undead mob in the game and your going to notice they all do negative damage. Ok, so Im trained to destroy evil… but my vuln is what every mob has? Then we get into the 120 weapons, no there is not just a soulcutter, which rapes me of course, there is also 2 more two handed weapons, one which does what, 385 natural?? So, how many hits can a maxed changeling take from that. And yes.. theres the ataraxia...
So, I get a horrible vulnerability, justified by holy wrath... an ability soley to fight evil with that goes rounds without taking effect. A titan gets a 4th attack consistently, and gets to 2for1 for more damage than holy wrath.
We wont get into titans atm..
Now, lets compare racial affects of vampire compared to slayer:
slayer
**Affects**: detect evil
Wow, something all remorts get.
**Skills**: holy wrath, shift, stake
Holy wrath is good, shift is good early, stake…. I'm still working on pulling
that off...
**Special abilities**: None
**Immune to**: None
**Resistant to**: None
No immunities? No resistances? Not even against.. negative? Oh wait, thats what I'm weak against, I guess the training didnt pay off…
**Vulnerable** to: negative
Of course!
Vampire
**Affects**: detect invisibility, detect hidden Now thats what I'm talking about.. something useful!
**Skills**: bite, consume, fast healing, shape, shift, temperance
Ah wear to begin…
bite? For a chance of paralyzing? Consume? Fast healing????
Then of course we get shape for pk, when i have to run around naked for
stalking. Shift for fast early leveling.
**Immune to**: poison
**Resistant to**: disease
Sure, they arent glorious, but better than what the slayers are getting..
**Vulnerable to**: fire, holy, light
You would think this is horrible, but the fact is, how many spells do light and holy damage?? Colour spray? Theres a pk spell for ya.. Glorious bolt?
What a pile of crap that is… And lets compare fireball to energy drain.. Can you win a pk fight casting fireball every round? No. Can you win a PK fight casting energy drain? Yes you can. I promise you if you take a vampire and a slayer at the same stats and eq, slayer casting fireball, and vampire casting energy drain the vampire will win. (unless hes blinded of course from fireball which is not a guarantee)
And the max stats? Number 1, to the 3rd to last. What a joke.
Clearly the evidence shows vampire is a much more effective race. And if your saying 'But a vampire cant go in the sun!!' Dont fight in the sun.
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Ok, now lets talk about the biggest imbalance of the game….
**Titans**
wtf….
They do more damage than you. They can take more damage than you.
What takes you 10 rounds to kill, theyll do it in 6\. They are huge. You are
large at best, medium at average, and a dwarf? Sigh.
Soooooooo... lets cast some lightning bolts... woops, im already dead, how many rounds was that?
Behold!! Chain lightning! Oops, that cost me a round of initiative and alot of life. OOops, Im dead again.
Ok, maybe spells arent the way to go, I'll just use my trusty trapsoul whip.
Ouch, wtf is he wielding?? Ow, a sword of stugardd and an ataraxia..
Geezus.. Whats next...
Ah, lets go with dispelling him... wtf, it bounced back! Ok, whats he doing, oh he played a song, but I cant counter that! Shit, I'm dispelled...
rem all; wear all
wtf, he cast spell deflection on me!!! I have no affects, who let that be cast in pk fights??? Thats like.. like, silence for free, and faster too!
But I thought titans were dumb?? Oh my, they have 25 25 25 25 25 stats like everyone else I forgot... but they are slow right? Nope, they have 25 25 25 25 25... Glad I went destroyer for my 4th attack... oh boy, he got that for free just for going titan! But but, I thought they were slow??
Lets get it straight, the best shit in the game is what? For stats, life. In the end mr elf, doesnt matter how many times your healing yourself, while your healing hes going to dispel or what not.
And what else? Hit roll and damage roll. Want to win at pk? Go druid and enchant your way to cheese. There was a time when I thought dispel and blind were the key. Doesnt make much of a difference when your taking
massive amounts of damage and have to deal twice as much. Its ironic that such popular class combos of druid,sage,illusionist,bard are the most powerful.
Enough ranting, what can we do to fix this atrocity...
For starters, make pk battles last a little longer. Now I dont mean the 10 minute fights, but tone the damage down. Theres no time for tactics, after a round and youve lost 1500 life, wtf can you do?
Titanic attack is just ridiculous. Get rid of that garbage. If the fact that titans get to hold a two handed weapon isnt enough... at leeeast change it so theres a 1 in 10 chance of increased damage. Truthfully though it just needs to be removed. For the love of god, they can have over 5000 life?
The 25 stats for everyone just doesnt make sense. (Except for lich btw which gets shafted yet again in the dexterity...) Anyways, stats should really have a cap off of some sort. Otherwise all the classes are the same except for hp mana move and vulns.
Another thing, titans should really be vulnerable to magic. Makes sense to me? Personally, I think the lightning vulnerability makes no sense. From a mythological standpoint that is.
Titans should require more movement in fact, and have to eat and drink twice as often.
The point is there should be negatives to going a race that has the strongest bonus in the game. Like I said, wtf is the point of holy wrath if I could have went titan and done even more damage to evil? And to good, and to neutral. Like myth said, screw evil, they aren't the power of the game, its the good races that get to pick the over powered bard and races.
(except for slayers of course)
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Slayers and Vamps.
Well, Slayers form is a great Skill for Cpking. Quick quick!!! Kill if they aren't dispelled in time. Granted, they are most likely not going to take on a 120 remort maxed. Just can't take the damage, but a slayer with a Pandora’s Box, and a Silky Sack does have a great advantage. Doesn't have to worry about losing any thing important ever. Just like a werewolf though. Idea is to adjust Slayers so they can morph into different mobs like a vampire does. However, it makes the game too common. The thought of a slayer gaining a damage type when shifted is too over powered too.
Titans I have even said are off balance. To a point, I think switching their mana with Minos. And Well, even a little less Mana would make it fair. However, the game is being updated, so who knows, Titans could easily become the worst class in the game do to complaints.
Drows and Elf.
Elfs are really tough atm. And soon they will gain immunity to magic and not just magic weapons. From what I have heard, the Magic immunity isn't their yet. Over all, pretty damn hard to kill have no weakness that I have known of. I can't think of any Iron weapons at 120 I would use.
Drows are monsters. A drow can have an extreme amount of defenses. They gain speed swerve. They have a little less mana and a little more health, not much of a difference still. And it can avoid all physical attacks, I am not sure how it goes on the magics like fireball. The ataraxia will be of no use, seeing as they are only weak against light and silver. Light weapons in the game, that I know are good. None. Silver would be The mishkal.
Dracs and Siths.
There is no way to compare these 2\. They are in no way they same. Draconians are big, and extremely tough. Vuln to cold, and there is ONE frost weapon I know of. A mace in Bottle. Whoopy damn do. But I think that’s changing this update. They have a lot of Life, and 2 handed dual wield. Lethal as all hell. And Titans can get spanked from them though some wouldn't agree. Mainly do to they have no vuln. Their breath can rape any character vuln to Frost, fire, or lightning. I believe those are the breaths. Then siths. They have the most lethal skill in the game. Sleep bite. Pretty much decides the battle. They can sleep you and slit throat and end the round. Easy as that, if they mess up more than 3 or 4 times, they are most likely going to die. And a great combo, they will bite you, and then if you are poisoned, they will drain life until you sleep. Hopefully this can be changed later in the update.
Dwarfs, humans, Liches.
Neutral race is a good race because you can go any direction and chose any class you want. Well, big frickin deal. People usually pick combo classes to win Battles. Bard, illusionist, sage. Gladiator, Destroyer, Ninja. Those kind of things. People just pick what classes will make them the strongest. So it really isn't a big deal on what classes they can pick.
Humans, plain and simple suck balls. I say a 200, boost on stats would make them a little more useful.
Dwarfs, Immune to all affects other than drain life. Drowning??? Please. Though a flood room skill for a Geomancer would be hilarious. Could be a good idea to take out dwarfs. Flood the room, unless you have underwater breathing, you are screwed. Or make it an illusionist skill and every one believes they are underwater. Point is, Dwarfs rock, and aren't easy to kill. Liches, Maybe the most fun of any race. Immune to many lethal affects. Weakness is, they can't get hit. EVER. But those who know how strong spirit rack is, it does cold damage and does some insane damage. If someone would take the time to make it to 120 remort, and max its stats, it could be a good race. As a helper race, they are amazing. They can heal, and cast spells like mad, they are the best helper race in my opinion.
Emtae
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BTW misbalance isnt a word.
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Well to add more onto Slayers. Slayers shifted can do around 2000 a turn easy. It is almost unblockable as well. A normal slayer can get 7 attacks, a changeling can generate 8 attacks if they are a destroyer. And against evil they can possible do 3k a turn or more. Most Slayers will go Monk for the hand to hand boost. So a slayer can also catch, dodge, and will ahve acrobatics. Plus the lethal counter spell. This can pretty much garantee a good player success every time. Also, Slayers don't need armors, so a pandoras box, and a silky can garantee a loss of nothing. And also, slayers can't be detected other than hunting.
And there is also a bug (maybe) with slayers. Slayers can shift out of sleep. Meaning, black Jack, and Sith Toxins can be prevented by shifting out of slayer form, into human form. Vampires can currently do this as well.
As I said, every race has its flaw. Titans are a pk race. They are gifted at tanking. Also the 25 stats are being changed into something more reliable later on. I know titans are going to be changed, I am happy with them atm, but I know they are going to be changed.
Emtae
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Posts tend to have a lot more impact when they are written with actual, constructed thought and without cursing. I find these posts to be extremely whiney and not worth the effort to even read the babble that is spewed out from it. "X race does Y against Z and I don't like it." Myth started a decent topic and it is being ruined. I will be adding my thoughts to this later on, but I hope that others will put this back on course and give thought out reasons and changes to races other than what has been posted.
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Well, here is my 2 cents…
Personally i think that Myth has a point but it only goes so far. Most of the good races (staticaly) are stronger and meaner than the evil races. But I see balance in this, because the evil classes (2 of them) get an insta kill. Granted assassin slit throat is kinda crap (yes a sith just said this) and the kill spell is quite useful and chesse in pk (dispel magic, kill, woo hoo i win).
I think the titans are over powered but not because of the two handed weapon in one hand thing (personaly i think they should get that like the dracons do, as in REMORT ONLY) but because of the extra attack in a round. True, elves get an extra attack because they have racial haste, which doesn't give them the +4 to dex. The main differance is that titans can still be hasted, so if done right a level 40 mort titan can have 6 attacks a round. I can only have 6 attacks after i remort.
The sith...Take out the sleep toxin. done. (yes a sith said this) I think it makes pk cheap and pointless. I bite you, you fall asleep, i kill you and eat your brains....ummmm....brains. I'd say just remove it from the game. But i would like for the sith neurotoxin to do something (i've heard it will in an upcoming update). Also, why do the Sith have the hiest move in the game? None of our special ablities use move. lower our move or make our ablities use move, at least that way the highest move in the game might be justified.
The Vamp needs to have it's stats (as in hp/ma/mv) lowered. Not drastically, but lowered like maybe 300 points across the board ( 100 from each stat). Not to mention needing a quest item to see through the shape ablity, is sick. I mean at least a spell, or a remort only spell. I think that's fair.
The dracons and minotars need more move. the only reason to play one is because to the niffty little attack that they get (breath and charge respectaly). Both of these attack forms take a stupid amount of move (minotars get screwed on this one) and don't do enough damage (dragons are a different story, after all they are remorts and should be more powerful). Now granted, i have never played a minotar in this game but i have heard that if one uses charge then it takes like 40 move per creature in the room (i'm counting if a player is in the room as well, thats why i didn't say mob). I don't know how true this is...but if it is...
Personaly i would honestly like to see insta kills removed from the game (slit, kill, behead, smite, Sith sleep [not an insta kill, but pisses off a lot of people]).
I've said this before. I would like to see all the races have 9000 (or another number, whatever) points distrbuted across hp/ma/mv. I would also like to see 90 (or whatever number) points distrbuted across the 5 stats (str, int, wis, dex, con) this would give the human 18 across the board. After all if human is suposed to be the base race (i'm guessing that it is), then why do they get shafted so bad. I don't care what people say about them being balanced (cause they don't get anything for or against them, so…it's balanced). If they were balanced against the other races then more people would play a human. Right now, i can't think of a single human (although i know someone will correct me on this) in the game that is or was worth a damn.
If everyone, and i mean everyone, wants "game balance" then we should all get screwed in one way or another. We all lose something, we can keep what makes the different races unique, but we need (so many of us say "need" like it's going out of style on these forums) is to be powered down...unless you are a human.
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oh yeah i forgot about stake as an insta kill. (although it is kinda useless anyway) it sould go too. (I know i'm forgetting at least one more, maybe not)
The only reason i'm saying any of this is to try and make pk more fun (and a challange) for everyone. Besides everyone would cherish their pk stats so much more if they really had to work for it.
My third cent
Crawley
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All comparisons are made to human. No class selection of said races is pertinent to this as class balancing is an entirely different subject. Nor are remort races being discussed, as they are technically a seperate race in and of themselves so have different balancing issues.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Slayer 20 20 20 20 20 3250 2750 2750
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Affects: detect evil
Skills: holy wrath, shift, stake
Immune: None
Resistant: None
Vulnerable: negative
Overall: I would say that slayers are fine as they are. The only thing that I could say that would should be changed is moves, which I could see going up to 3000\. They are hunters, by nature, which means that their ability to move around should be greater than their spellcasting abilities.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Elf 20 22 20 21 20 2500 3750 2800
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Affects: haste
Skills: archery, bow, hide, sneak
Special abilities: +5% accuracy when shooting ranged weapons
Immune: None
Resistant: magic
Vulnerable: iron
Overall: Skills are easily gained through other classes, the affect is easy to obtain within the game and since the resistance hasn't truely been tested until the update is made, I would say that this race is rather balanced. I am not really sure about the vulnerability, but for the time being, it is best just to leave it alone.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Dracon 21 18 18 18 21 3150 2750 3000
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Affects: flying, infrared
Skills: breathe, fast healing
Immune: None
Resistant: fire, bash, charm
Vulnerable: cold
Overall: I think that charm is probably one of the worst sort of resistances to have in the game. Remove it from all races to start. I would also say to remove fire as a resistant, but keep bash as the scales tend to absorb damage, and it encompasses blunt damage. I am not sure if the vulnerable fits, but I would say that due to the metallic nature of the scales of dracons/dragons, they should have lightning.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Titan 23 18 18 17 23 3750 2450 2700
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Skills: bash, fast healing, titanic attack
Immune: None
Resistant: cold, fire
Vulnerable: lightning
Overall: Stats are a bit higher than Humans, with extra hit points. Most of the skills are easily obtained. Titanic attack should be changed from an extra attack, to extra damage. Perhaps +1 damage roll per ten levels or something close to that. Their resistances, to me, do not make sense. For me, I see them as huge humans, so remove the resistances and vulnerability and I think that this race would be closer to being balanced. Perhaps with time, if it is needed, a boost to mana, but shouldn't be added yet.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Dwarf 21 18 18 18 21 3350 2750 3500
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Affects: infrared, regeneration
Skills: berserk, repair
Immune: None
Resistant: acid, cold, fire, lightning
Vulnerable: drowning
Overall: I could see a +1 to str and con being added, drop all the resistances, add in resistance to earth, and no idea what this would encompass. Regeneration and repair make up for any lack that there might be otherwise.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Lich 18 23 24 16 23 2350 3850 2500
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Affects: pass door
Skills: crippling touch, rending, scry, spirit rack
Special abilities: mana regeneration is 2.5x normal
Immune to: charm, cold, lightning, kill
Resistant to: poison, pierce, slash
Vulnerable to: bash, fire
Overall: Highest overall stats, lowest hit points, highest mana. Again, remove the immunity to charm here. Actually, remove all the immunities except kill. Change them to resistances. Drop resistance to pierce and slash. Remove the vunerablity to bash. Perhaps increase hp up to Elf maximum. As is, everything else seems to be fine according to stats.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Sith 18 19 19 22 18 3100 3000 3750
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Skills: bite, hunt, sense danger, tail kick, toxins
Special abilities: None
Immune to: poison
Resistant to: None
Vulnerable to: fire, pierce
Overall: Slightly higher stats, couple of unique skills, couple that can be obtained through classes. I would change the vulnerable to fire to cold. There is entirely too much vulnerable to fire on the evil side of races. Otherwise, I would say this race is fine.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Minotaur 23 18 18 19 22 3500 2350 2500
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Affects: regeneration
Skills: bash, charge
Immune: None
Resistant: cold
Vulnerable: fire
Overall: Not a bad race, but lacking overall. I would say that if the vulnerability were to be dropped, then this race woulc be better suited to being balanced.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Vampire 22 18 20 19 18 3350 3250 3250
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Affects: detect invisibility, detect hidden
Skills: bite, consume, fast healing, shape, shift, temperance
Special abilities: None
Immune to: poison
Resistant to: disease
Vulnerable to: fire, holy, light
Overall: Good stats, good skills and affects. I think that the vulnerability to light should be dropped and leave it as sunlight being the true damaging factor. Shift should be made so that you can still where the person, shape should be limited to dark hours and still unable to where.
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Race Str Int Wis Dex Con HP Mana Move
Drow 18 22 20 20 18 2750 3500 2600
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Affects: infrared
Skills: crossbow, hide, sneak, swerve
Immune: None
Resistant: charm
Vulnerable: light, silver
Overall: Add one more to dexterity. Remove the resistance to charm and replace it with magic. I do not see why there should be so much removal from Elves. I think that they should share this resistance. Haste was replaced with a defense. Give them 5% accuracy to crossbows. Everything else, though, I think that this would make the race more balanced.
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Giving Titans added mana, removing their vulns, increasing their DR, and leaving their 2h weapon in 1h ability seems a little obscene.
While Titans may be viewed by you as a very large humans, Titans in the game are meant to resemble the Titans of Greek lore. That's why their gigantic size. Being compared to humans in this manner is quite lacking.
The overall end result in any of this in any case is that the races are still unbalanced.
Dracons get breathes, Sith get toxins.
Elves and Drow get greater ability in using ranged weapons.
Slayers and Vampires get the ability to shapeshift.
Titans and Minotaurs get increased regeneration capabilities.
All of this is nice, and very benificial for each of the race in showing their individuality in play, whether it be player vs mob or player vs player.
The problem lies in their inability to balance out. You put a Sith up against a Dracon of equal stature, the Sith is going to win 75% of the time.
An Elf and Drow are about 50/50, and are quite balanced with eachother (although I still feel that a first class elf should get a +1 dex bonus from racial haste, and a 4th class get +4.)
A Vampire and a Slayer in a fight, more often than not the Slayer is going to win. Their increased damage to evil gives them a superior advantage, and I would say Slayers would win 75% of the time.
With using 2h weapon in 1h and titanic attack, Titans are going to defeat Minotaurs at least 75% of the time.
For PK, this is how I feel the races stand in a PK fight:
1\. Titan
2\. Drow
3\. Elf
4\. Sith
5\. Dwarf
6\. Slayer
7\. Vampire
8\. Human
9\. Draconian
10\. Minotaur
11\. Lich
Liches get the shaft in PK ability. Minotaurs, while having high hp, and hp regeneration every round of combat, lose out due to their vuln to fireball/inferno/flaming on weapons, and flaming bite weapons (there are quite a few of these, and i'm not just talking about a 120 remort standpoint either. Pyrohydra's will rip apart a 3rd class minotaur when being used by a 3rd classer).
Minotaur's high HP and natural HP regeneration makes them last quite a long time in a fight. However, their vuln to fire damage greatly weakens them. Their mana is low, but usually die long before they are able to use it up. Charge is not a bonus in PK, since the skill is nearly worthless with it's high movement loss.
Draconians are also lacking in PK ability. Their breaths aren't very effective in PK combat, but they luck out with their resistance to fire and vuln to cold (which is very uncommon).
Humans are near the bottom of the list because the other races bonuses make them better pker's than a race that has nothing.
Vampire's ability to shape in and out of werewolf form, dispelling web, silence, and the like, is very beneficial in cpk situations, but in PK is near worthless. Their high stats is their only true saving grace.
Slayers are very well rounded PKers, and have the same benefit in cpk situations as vampires, but their 25% damage increase against evil aligned races make them a tougher foe than vampires.
Dwarves are resistant to all of the elements, and high decent enough stats to allow them to get by quite well. Belexus is a prime example of this. Their berserk gives them a massive hp bonus when at 120 remort, allowing them to reach over 5k hp.
Sith's sleep toxin makes them an odd variable in PK and CPK situations. Sometimes it works, other times it doesn't. Their higher stats are a good bonus for them in helping them in these pk situations. And while many believe Sith to be lacking in PK, I've fought enough in my time on this game to know that they pack a more powerful punch than they are alloted.
Elves' natural resistance to magic makes them a very difficult foe. Dispelling them sometimes seems impossible. Match this with their ranged weapon bonus in using bows to shoot you inbetween rounds, as well as the inability to dispel their haste, they are a very formidable challenge.
Drow's added defence in speed swerve makes them a hard target to hit. With a good class path, Drow's can be some of the toughest fighters in the game. Spunky showed this well.
Titan's titanic attack and ability to use a 2h weapon in 1h makes them the largest powerhouse of all. Since PK is based on doing the most damage the fastest and little skill and tactic is involved, being able to use the highest damaging weapon in the game (staugaard) teamed up with an ataraxia, they can deal more damage in a round than many can heal. Add in titanic attack, and you're toast. Your best bet is to either dispel them, keep them blind, and hope for the best, or run to save your life.
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For the two handed weapon held in one hand, I still say that a second weapon shouldn't be able to be used, but a shield could be, or one attack be removed due to the slow attack speed and recovery, no matter what ones strength is.
And titans, norse or greek, I see as oversized humans. I always have and always will. :P
Also, I think that pitting drow vs elf, sith vs dracon, etc, just makes it all the more difficult to balance and should ultimately be taken out. There should not have to be a counterbalance of race vs race, but reviewed as balanced against the only neutral race, human.
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every race has an advantage and disadvantage towards humans. the slayer vs vamp, etc, thing was a way to balance feuding races. this was also not supposed to overpower say, elf over sith. it was a building block to work from.
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Yeah, being a lich, I am getting owned by anyone with a fireball, flamestrike, demonfire, pyroblade, the list goes on (fire is the most common weapon as well as the most common vuln, at least in the evil/neutral area) and spirit rack is severly weak, so I might as well use circle in a fight against a dracon. Lichs are supposed to be super magic creatures, but I hardly even use magic, its too slow, takes a lot of mana, and I'm better off with my swords. Not to mention the ownage I take to magic effects, the Bag Man of olaria was beating the crap outta me, and he has magic, so I mean, whats up with that? The two vulns on lich seem quite overpowered since bludgeon (i.e. fists, clubs, maces)is quite common primarily fist and kick, and fire everything is fire anymore, especially 3rd class and up.
-Baelwolf
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Umm Spirit Rack is weak? It requires no movement, it does cold damage, I don't think it is blockable in any way, and it is actually faster than circle. I have a lich, I know it is very affective. If you aren't using it correctly then its your own fault. Liches have shit for life, but the most mana in the game. No one said it would be easy to be a lich. So learn to not ever get hit. Liches will also have to aquire every hp armor/weapon/light in the game because eventually, they are going to get hit. Liches are very good and have vulns just like every one else.
As far as vulns, other than humans, every race in the game has one. So you are just going to have to just be careful, and use the classes best fit for a lich. So being mounted I think may be the worst idea ever for a lich.
Emtae
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I still say that Fire isnt the way to go, it's incredibly easy to get hit by fire, and everyone has it, and does a crapload of damage. What I don't understand though is, why are lichs immune to charm? I havent ever seen charm used on a character, let alone many mobs. Maybe it could be swapped out for a different one?
Also, a side note, does anyone else think that poison needs to be revamped a bit? I've not seen it too effective in combat or after even, it doesnt really do much, perhaps if it were to take on the property of toxins? Something along those lines–-
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Well on Iths idea. I do like the idea of holding a shield and a 2 handed weapon. For me it doesn't matter, when the game updates, I won't be using dual wield any way. Seeing as a I am a bard, I am going to lose dual wielding it seems.
But losing Titanic attack. Well, I did think of a few ideas, that I would like people to comment on all the ideas with some thought and just not saying no.
Size damage
%damage on size of enemy. When game updates, I was hoping for an idea of true size for all races. Titans being the biggest, Elves actually being the smallest. Not because they are short, but because dwarfs are thicker, and more brawd. So it could be like a 50% extra % damage kicking in. Nothing insane, like 1-15% random. But more painful for smaller and skinnier enemies.
Defence Break
Parry/shield block/wilderness spear/catch break. Another skill, rated on weight of item and titanic attack skill. Catch would be strength, bonus of giant strength, and race size. This would allow a titan to do like 25% damage every so often a parry. Or have it more rare, but completely break the defence and do normal damage. It could be something based on defence to, like a shield block would just knock the enemy over, do a slight amount of damage, as wear catch did a whole lot more.
Ithilidans idea on the Dr per level. But, it would only add up to 12dr… not liking that.
Not liking this idea. But having titanic attack being a seperate attack you can do like bash what ever, but do 1.5 damage or so. Or even double.
combat starter
Well, not my favorite, but when an apponent is at 75+ hp a titan can start combat with a very lethal attack. Doing a large amount of damage. It should be slow, but if hit, an actual great amount of damage. Pretty much would look like this.
Emtae Lifts his Stuagaard high into the air. 1 second delay, 1.5.
Emtae crushes you with a mighty blow, knocking you off your feet.
THAT REALLY DID HURT!!!
So it would be a combat starter or, it could also be a skill to use in battle, and it has some good lag to it. As a 1 second delay or so, it will be hard to actually start combat, but, it would be a Titan Attack.
Those are the main ideas I had on titans. But I would like to hear some good comments on it. Every race other than humans (i thinks being changed) has a skill or 2 or some other benefit. Titanic attack is something that people want to take away all together, but take it away, they titans are just large humans with a weakness and more hp.
To make balance, I was thinking about having true vulnerables. As in, instead of 25% it would be like 10% or 50% what ever. This could make some classes more justified. Like a Sith, I thinks siths would be weak against cold. Snake, cold etc. And a slight weakness to fire, seeing as snakes do try to use warmth.
Vampires, fire should fry the shit out of them.
Slayers, 15% to negative, strong against fire. I would immagine they wield it commonly. Slayer form could change things up. They could use some other weakness though, or else they would be unbalanced with that change.
Titans, 10% 10% on fire ice, Lighting 15% but 10% on negative too.
Dragons should be able to chose what they are strong and weak against. They should be strong against one form, and weak to another in thier opinion from start of the game. Seeing as they can breath elements too, it would affects the power of their breaths.
Minos should be strong against ice because of fur, a little weaker against fire like normal, and normal with Lightning.
The other Classes, are a toss up. This would balance the pking a bit though. May even make people rethink weapons and armors. And slow down how fast battles can go.
There are other things, but I will talk about them later. I do want people ideas on Titanic attack. In the end, syn will decide, but would help to actually have some positive and useful feedback.
Emtae
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~~@Mythology:~~
> every race has an advantage and disadvantage towards humans. the slayer vs vamp, etc, thing was a way to balance feuding races. this was also not supposed to overpower say, elf over sith. it was a building block to work from.
I can see the point, but then people will want x race balanced perfectly with y race, while still remaining balanced with humans. The problem that I see with this is that the only way to do that is to make each race identical to the other then balance it out to humans, and then, what really is the point?
I hold that if we just work out balancing in relation to humans, then just use a storyline to pit races against each other, it would be better.
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Well, some change in balance I think is a good idea. Have one race strong to one, but weak to another. Like I said, if every one is 50 50, then it kinda takes the danger of say, a slayer vs evil. A slayer is supposed to own evil, but why not have a problem with good spanking a slayer around then. I think unbalance in some areas is a good idea.
Emtae
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Obviously your not comprehending my point Emtae. The point was that if your 2 in 1 handing it does consistently more damage than the random holy wrath damage bonus.
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OK, missbalance. In a battle, someone just did 3500 damage to me in one turn, and it could have been more, I just died when I lost all my health in less that one round. All it took, a dispel and quaffing a chain lighting potion. Instant Kill. If someone can do that, Titans are in no way Broken. And I know people want to use the exploting vuln. WTF. 3500 damage in 3 seconds. My suggestion. Just make brewing chain lighting impossible. It takes no lag, and it can kill a titan in about 3 seconds. Yeah, that is fair.
Emtae
